Just do that. People just don't walk up and hang their sign on the fence. That doesn't sound right. No, it doesn't. Sure it does. Of course, you get bitched at for doing it. I'll say if that's the case, let me know because I'll hang my business sign. I'll do a business sign and hang it there. That's a good location. Yeah. You do that, and then when you get called on, you go. No. Somebody's on the corner. I mean, I've got signs. Where is it? If nobody says anything, what the hell? Right across from the fire station, people are hanging signs. My church wants to hang a Easter invitation banner up there. I was going to ask if it's okay to hang it. But I asked him. He gave me a... Well, Adam Teagan would be the guy. Yeah. but just call, you can either email Adam or call the general number, and I'm sure they'll point in the right direction. Some of our military men were brought back, and unfortunately, a body was standing over the committee. He was saluting, but he had a baseball cap on. But the reason I sent that to you is that's in District 3, and you're the older for District 3, right? Okay, it is 5.30. We will call the march. public safety committee meeting to order. What did you break? Okay. What are you breaking over there? Roll call. Everybody is present. Public comment. Is there anybody here for public comment? Anybody on the wall? Okay. First call. Second call. Third call. Public comment is closed. Consent agenda. Is there anybody that would like anything removed from the consent agenda? If not, I'll make a motion to approve the agenda as presented. Second. We've got a motion and a second. Discussion? If not, all in favor? Aye. Cummings. No, Anderson. I got renamed. I was looking at Mike when it was said. Sorry. I'll let somebody else have the glory. Discussion and action items. First item on the agenda, 26-0171, Sex Offender Residency Board Appeal for Dominic Robinson. This gentleman is currently, he's not here, obviously, because he's at Kettle Moraine Correctional Institution right now, but it sounds like he will be getting out. I did speak with the probation officer. He is from Green Bay, city of Green Bay. He has no connections here in Manitowoc. And as you're all aware, when we look at the waiver, we want some sort of network of people that are going to support him or her to not reoffend. That's really not the case here. The reason that they're looking at moving to Manitowoc is simply because Green Bay is refusing to let him live there. So his mom or parents live too close to a school or a park or something like that, and they're just not letting him live there. So that doesn't mean that it's not a good reason to come and live here and waive this ordinance, I don't feel. The form isn't completely filled out, which I'm not thrilled about either. And Alder Schley is no longer on this board, but when he was, he was a pretty big stickler for that as well. But even if it was, after talking to the probation officer, I just don't see that there would be enough here to say we should waive it. But certainly that is up to the committee. Thank you. Anybody? Well, I'll get the ball started just so that we can discuss it. I'll make a motion to deny the request for... the appeal, if you will, so. Second. Elder Cummings, did you have anything? No, I was going to agree with the Chief from my review as well, and I was looking at his input, or waiting, I had my notes to wait for his input, but I was going to say deny it as well. Okay. So we have a motion and a second. Any further discussion? None. All in favor? Aye. All opposed? The motion carries unanimously. I thought you were going to ask a question. No. Item on the agenda, 226-0172, School Resource Officer Agreement for the City of Manitowoc and Manitowoc Public School District. Okay, I'm not sure if your copy has tracked changes at all. Mine does not that I'm looking at. No, it doesn't, okay. Well, the city attorney put this together after we all had a meeting, city attorney, myself, Deputy Chief Puzol, Superintendent Lee Tennis, Sergeant Kroc. Basically, we had a concern from one of our school resource officers about how the mileage was reimbursed. And we just decided to do what we probably always should have been, which is just however many miles you use in your personal vehicle to drive from one school to the next, that's what you mark down and that's what you get paid. There was some longstanding concern a handwritten note that said they get $40 a pay period, was it? A month, $40 a month, no matter how many, whether they go over that mileage or stay under it. So we felt like we should just, it's more fair to just, you know, basically say this is how many miles, this is the rate, which is set by the state or the feds. And that's the rate. And that rate takes everything into consideration, whether it be gas, wear and tear maintenance, insurance. So it's a pretty good rate for the individual. But there are situations where one of our SROs has to drive their personal vehicle more often than the others. The other thing that we put into place, we are going to hold back one of our squad cars that we would normally turn in and trade in. We're going to hold one of those back and make it into more of an SRO squad that that officer can just drive to the police department, use that squad for their day, drive from school to school, and that'll cut down on their mileage anyways. Part of that disagreement also was updated to state that when that officer uses that squad car, the school will reimburse us for those miles. Because right now the school was reimbursing us, you know, the officer, now they'll reimburse the city for using that city vehicle. The other thing that changes in this contract, DARE, teaching DARE was in here. We are taking that out. The school wants to focus more on the education aspect, the things that they need to get done, the basic education things versus DARE. So they asked and we agreed that we would no longer teach DARE in the public schools. So that is carved out of here as well. I think that's pretty much it. All right, thanks. Motion to approve. Second. Motion and a second. Any further discussion? Yep, just a quick question to make sure I fully understand. So then the school, are they the ones reimbursing the mileage if they use a personal vehicle? Yes. And then also then reimbursing the police department if you use the squad car in that aspect? Correct. Okay, that was it. And then the dare piece, like no dare whatsoever anymore? Correct. So what we looked into is we are one of the very few agencies and school districts that are having DARE anymore. And again, it was more their decision than it was ours. We would keep teaching it. And they're paying for it. So it's kind of one of those things I can't say, hey, you got to keep doing this when you're paying for it. So I don't think it's the wrong decision by any means. I agree with the school. But again, we would have kept teaching it if that's what we kind of came to a consensus. We are still teaching it. We have DARE officers, certified DARE officers with the police department teaching it in some of the Lutheran and Catholic grade schools, but not in the public school anymore. Thank you. Yep. Any further discussion? All in favor? Aye. All opposed? Passes unanimously. Next agenda on the... Next item on the agenda... 26-0187, discussion, public-private school snow removal. So when I went walking around for my signatures this year, this came up about a dozen times, and then the next item came up probably two to three dozen times about specifically the school in my districts, but I know the same issues arise at all of our schools, program and private. So I just wanted to bring it up to the and see if there's any solutions that we can come up with to make our residents safer. Mr. Chairman, could Billy be given? I was just going to invite him up. You want to come up, Billy? Yeah, I mean, I guess currently, I think the only two schools that don't have at least one street, the main street in front of them that is not on the salt route is the Roncalli School on Waldo Boulevard and Bethany off of Meadow Lane. It's like 33rd is probably their main entrance that is not on the salt route. And I guess I don't know if the Roncalli School, if it's 14th or 15th, that's the main entrance there. for the drop-off zone, and that would be the other one. Otherwise, I think all the other schools, the main drop-off area is on a salt route already. It doesn't go all the way around the school, but at least one street in front of the school is on a salt route currently. So I guess what... The constituents were asking is would it be possible to get the salt around the schools because that's where all the parking and kids are walking across and you're trying to stop. And if there's two inches of ice that we get sometimes, even if you're going 10 miles an hour and you're selling your brakes, you're still going to slide for a while before you stop. So you're asking that every street all the way around all the schools would be a salt road? Right. And if that'd be a lot of extra work or because... If they just had to go around the block, how much extra time would that actually take the city? Well, I guess I didn't know exactly what the request was going to be, so I didn't look into that at all. I can figure it out, kind of give you an idea on salt usage and stuff like that, what it would take, time. I'm just trying to think of which ones would be. Because I think Madison will no longer be used for next school district. And I know Ron Cowley, like they have you come in the parking lot on 15th and you exit on 14th. Yeah. So they make a circle. Yeah, so you'd have to do 14th, 15th. 33rd and 32nd. Dale. One rule is covered. Jefferson would be that section of Manila. 23rd is not, 21st is, so that section of 23rd would have to be added. And then depending, School Street and 9th Street are on Wilson. I think that's it. I mean, make a motion to send this to public infrastructure with his estimates. Well, I just want to say quick, I noticed that a lot of the complaints came When we'd have a decent snowfall overnight, the plows could only make one pass north, south, east, west, just to open the roads up. So then you had the parking lanes. That's when I seen a lot of it. They were talking about the side streets around the schools where you park and all the kids walk across and they walk up between cars and you don't see them until they're right there. Wouldn't it be that much extra for that safety aspect of the kids? it's just a little bit, I feel like it'd be worth that. Yeah, I mean, I don't think it'd be bad to send it to public infrastructure. Mr. Cummings? Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I can certainly appreciate all their debates in bringing this up. And obviously safety for kids is obviously important. You know, the thing is that what I get with this, and I've been on the public infrastructure, is, you know, every... Every snowfall that we have, people are always complaining about the snow plowing. Like, unless we get double the amount of snow plows, double the amount of resources, nobody's going to be happy to some aspect. I mean, I can tell you, I get, for the downtown area, I get complaints every snowfall that we don't, you know, do enough on 8th Street and 10th Street and everywhere else. I mean, realistically, it's a monumental job to do it and it eventually gets done, right? It's just a matter of when and people adjust. I guess... from just hearing a little bit. Obviously right now there's not enough information to have that educated decision of, hey, this is what we should do or shouldn't do. So I do agree that it should get referred somewhere if we wanna do it. But in the grand scheme of things, unless there's been data where we've had a ton of accidents after snow storms, ton of accidents at schools, ton of injuries. I mean, I don't know if there's enough that's gonna ultimately at the end of the day make it change personally. That's my gut feel. That being said, we can certainly look at it and then make an educated decision. But, I mean, like I hate to say it, but, you know, this is everywhere you're going to get people complaining. That's just what people do, you know. I mean, we invest $6 million in roads every year, and we have people say that our roads suck. Like, I mean, we could invest. I was thinking about it when I bought a lottery ticket. I was like, you know, if I win the lottery, should I invest some money into the roads? I don't know if you can invest enough money and have people not complain about something. So I'm not saying that it's not an excuse. I'd support referring it to public infrastructure to get looked at. But I don't think it's something that's insanely pressing where there's a break at this point. Yeah, I would agree. And like I said, when they open up the roads quick just so everybody can get where they got to go, they don't always get back to do that. Next pass along the curb. So I think a lot of the complaints come from that. But yeah, I have no problem sending it to public infrastructure for further eval. Chief has a comment. Just want to remind everyone, too, that if you do that, which is fine, or if we change those salt routes, we have to add signs to that. We have to add the little red and white signs. And then we have to change ordinances. So it's not going to happen overnight. because you have to have ordinances backing up those signs, and we have to put the signs in possibly pools and different things up. So it's not going to just be the cost of the salt and extra plows. And it's also, I mean, I don't want to speak for Billy, but it's going to, you're right, other companies that are not going to obviously get more snow plows and more snow plowers. So other places would suffer possibly, or just it would take longer. I'm not sure. I'm not a snow plow driver, but mostly I just wanted to state the fact about the fact that that the salt roads all have to have those signs and then ordinances backing those up. So that would have to be looked into. Thanks. Other debates? I was thinking more of just the snowfalls that we don't plow the rest of the streets because there's not enough snow. Not when, like it wouldn't be, clean it up better at the schools than we would anywhere else in the city. Just on those two, two and a half inch snowfalls where the side streets don't get plowed at all. at least plow around the schools at that point after everything else is done. I guess that's what I was trying to get done. So then when the sun comes out, it melts it and it'll be safer around the schools that way. I guess I wasn't trying to get it plowed every time it snowed with the salt road, just that if we're only doing the salt roads, then that gets added on. If that makes sense. Makes sense to me. Pardon? Is there a name for that? Like when they only plow, do they call that like another plow? Well, there's either an emergency snow ban is when all the streets get plowed. A snow ban is just when the salt routes get, or even bus routes get plowed. And then we have a new downtown parking where we just have a ban where the downtown is and you can't park down there. When they only get two inches, what do you plow? So when... Yeah, when we plow all the side streets throughout the entire city, we call it a general plow. So that's what they would be referring to as adding? No, because during a general plow, they would be plowed. I guess I'm trying to think of, like, if we get a two and a half inch snowfall, we're probably plowing all the streets. There's a good chance if we get a two inch snowfall, we're probably plowing all the streets, depending on what the weather is following behind. The last couple storms that we had, we didn't plow because we had 40 degree temperatures coming in two days. And it was, you know, just the timing of it and everything. And we didn't, I mean, we had right around an inch both times. But, you know, in the middle of winter, if we get a two inch snowfall and winter is going to stay and we don't have, you know, 40 degree temperatures coming, we're probably going to be plowing that. So I just kind of take that into thought as well. So if there's an inch, inch and a half, you're not going to plow, necessarily. Not a general plow, probably not. Inch and a half, you might be close. I'm not sure. Do you drop salt or sand? For example, I guess what I'm saying is there's been a number of times where there's been snow. I've had a shovel. It wasn't much. And later in the afternoon, a A snowplow comes through, but the plow isn't down, but he's throwing sand or salt or Lord knows what. Yeah, we'll do sand and or salt at the Stop Signs Hills intersections and curves so that it gives, you know, the ability to stop. And I think what William or Alder debates was looking at is maybe just being a little more thorough around the block that the school sits on, not just the salt route or this or, you know, if you guys are out for any reason, just make one trip around the block and either salt it, sand it, or plow the damn thing. Just, you know, just around the block, not down the block or this, just around the block that the school sits on. And I think that's what he's looking for. I would support it after you go back and you put a pencil through and say, geez, you know, if we do that for all the schools, it's going to take us an hour and a half or two hours additional plowing. OK, that's nice to know. Or I need four tons more of salt or sand or whatever. I think if we had that information, I think most people would be able to sit and go, okay, if that's all it is around the school and this is the price of that, you know, and then we'd vote on it up or down or send it back and say we need more information. I don't know. But thank you. If you could do it before I cleared the sidewalk so they don't get buried again. All right, so what would we say? Motion to refer to public infrastructure. Okay. To the department and the committee, yes. All right. I'll second that. We got a motion and a second to refer it to public infrastructure. Any further discussion? If none, all in favor? Aye. All opposed? All right. I don't think you have to say general, because the general, they get it. Just that when there is... Right, that when there is a snow that they pay. Just parking for corners. Yeah, because generally you'd be doing it anyway. Yeah, you pay closer attention to the block that the schools are on around there, the streets. It doesn't matter whether it's one inch, two inches, or what. To add all streets around public, private schools to plow and salt roads for every snowfall. Basically. For every snow plow, snowfall that they plow. Yes, period. Anywhere. Anytime they go out with a truck. But they're not going to go out with that. Right, yeah. Okay. It doesn't matter. We just have to have something for them to actually do when we're referring it. Because if we're referring it and we send it to them and they're going to look at it like, what do you want me to do with it? Well, this is government, so. And I was just happy that I understood general plowing. No, that's why I was. Okay. Okay, last item on the agenda, 26-0188, discuss safer parking and pedestrian crossings near schools. So I've talked to the crossing guards and many parents, and I don't know if we want to try to do painted curbing or put the signs up that say no parking from here to corner on these intersections around the school again, because... I pick up kids and a lot of times they're within a foot and a half of the corner, halfway covering up the sidewalk and you can't see anything happening when you're trying to make turns around the corners, especially by Franklin when you're on the side streets, sometimes with how close people park. So I just thought something visible and if that means parking lines, depending on the school, because it makes more sense, I don't know. I would love to hear your thoughts about it, because I'm sure you hear a lot of complaints. I don't actually, but I think it would be helpful if we have specific, like this is a general statement, and I feel like if we had more of a specific problem area that we can attack, that would be the way to go with this. Just a general statement, we have a lot of schools, obviously. And a lot of times we think that we're going to solve a problem by changing parking and we create another problem. So a lot of these, you know, we're thought through throughout the years. Maybe there's some that slip through the cracks that we can better. I know it drives me nuts. I was just having a conversation with somebody today about Jackson School, Emanash Avenue. It's the parking signs and everything. It just doesn't even hurt. I understand it, but I can see how people would be very confused by it. Of course, that's a school that's not going to, that's going to solve itself, I guess, for next school year. Um, but yeah, Franklin school, if you're aware of something specific, that is a problem. I think, you know, we go out there and we observe it ourselves and see if there's anything we can do. So like when people park between the drivers that have this workspace. Yeah, that's, that's, that's an enforcement issue for sure. We need to be out there and take any of that vehicle or at least educate them. And so you can't, that's illegally, they're illegally parked. Right. And that's what I've been seeing, especially by, uh, Ron Colley on Volvo. Okay. I'm 14th there. Like, it's horrible some days. 15th. Oh, okay. And I think they'll park wherever because they'll say don't park 20 feet to the curb and they'll put two more cars in there when it's pickup time. Well, they put the sign up. I don't think we really enforce it anyway because we know they're going to be leaving soon. Right. There's no other way to do it for the parents, for the violators, if you will. But, you know, your description when you talk about actually, like, they're parking and getting out of their vehicles when there's like this much space between driveways. No, that's not acceptable. When they're stopped in traffic temporarily, because obviously drop-off is usually not as big of a deal as pickup because everybody picks up at the same time and it's kind of controlled chaos or organized chaos. But I think people have to understand that it's a situation where you can't, kind of like Alder Cummings, talked about earlier, you're going to get complaints no matter what because there's so many vehicles at one time, there's going to be a need for people to be patient, which oftentimes they're not. And it could certainly be more of an enforcement issue than it is something that we can do here to say, hey, let's paint lines or people are only as good as people are going to follow them, I guess. I just feel like we need to do a better job of enforcing that. But keep those lines of communication going so we know when these are happening, where they're happening, and then we can more easily tackle it. Because obviously we have about six officers in I don't know how many schools. So when the complaints come in, write down where the issue is, and then you guys will try to look at it. Absolutely, time and location. Even if they get a plate number, we will call that person and educate them. That's been done a lot of times. Um, but yeah, sometimes it is a situation like Alder Beeman said, it's, it's kind of temporary and people just have to understand, okay, it's, these laws were written for more of like, okay, person can't park there, you know, for hours at versus, you know, sitting in traffic and trying to, to accomplish child pickup is, is somewhat different. It's kind of the spirit of the law versus the letter of the law. Yeah. And Alder Anderson. Alder Anderson. I was going to say something and I got lost. I saw your mind. Chad, I've got it easy. I can see all the names. I was just going to respond to you. I let him go first. You're just squirming like a worm on a hook. I was enjoying the moment. I'm sorry. I just have more of a curiosity question since we're on this. Following it. I've been asked, like, I live catty corner from, I think it's Wilson, over by Felician Village. And there's some houses there, obviously, that I have a three-car wide driveway. So it's not too much of a problem. But I've seen people ask me, like you said, hanging over a foot, two feet over the driveway. I understand it's not too much. But if someone's sitting in the car, you just ask them to move. But I've seen sometimes someone will actually get out of the car and leave like two feet of the car hanging over the driveway. A curious question I have, if it's a repeat offender, the same person doing it over and over, is it possible for someone to get a picture of the vehicle, the driveway, on the license plate, and turn that in? I'm just curious how, if like, well, just, no, they can't do anything even though you sent them. I was just curious, that's all. Certainly it's possible. We prefer to be the witnesses ourselves because it's possible that I hate to say this, but with AI and everything else that is generated out there, a photo isn't really that good to me anymore. But, you know, a photo, and if we talk to the person, they admit it, you know, then you got a little bit more there. But certainly, you know, just having that information, us being able to call, most of the people are good people, and they don't want a ticket. But to get out of your car, and then if somebody needs to get out of their driveway, you can't even move out of the way because you're not in your car anymore. That's a bigger problem, in my opinion, than somebody just kind of temporarily while waiting in their car, oh, they see somebody needs to get out of the driveway, they can move. It's a bigger problem, but either way, I don't want to say it's a necessary evil, but people need to just be smarter. Okay. So basically when someone asks me again, hey, what do I do? just write the license plate number down, call it in. And if they get a picture, that's even greater because the person that we're calling can't argue it as much. We've seen that before where they'll won't admit it until, because much of our traffic enforcement, we do take pictures and we have it downloaded into what's called Clancy. It's our parking ticket software. And once they see that, like I wasn't parked, you know, more than two feet from the curb. It's like, well, here we have a measuring tape and a picture and you were, I was like, That works. Thank you. Yeah. Alder Echelberg. It's not their job, but I know Alder Bates called me on this subject, and I'm going, you know, probably you can't do it, but it's something I would like to at least bring up, and that would be we've got these crossing guards at different locations. I don't know if they have or wouldn't. could be provided some kind of a camera. Or like I said, it wouldn't be their job, but they certainly could keep an eye out. And for example, if somebody complains, their job is to make sure the kids cross safely. But if there's no kids at the corner, they could snap a picture and or at least be an observer from the police department, so to speak, and write down the license plate number or whatever as, I guess, your... Your support for the call to whoever, you know what I mean? And I don't know if you talk anything about that when you give them their training every year where they come in and you tell them this is how you do it. I don't know if anything like that is look out for this stuff, don't look out for it, don't worry about it. Or if something with the crossing guards could be like just some kind of backup support for these... offenders you know where i mean they're standing there like this on the corner yeah that lady in the in the station wagon pulls up and parks halfway across that driveway every week you know or every day so yeah i mean it's possible but we really don't want to divert their attention because even though they maybe stand there at one point if their attention is diverted they're taking pictures and then a kid needs to cross we really want them to focus on child safety, you know, getting the kids across, and that's... That's what I was worried about. That's why, you know, I mean, I'm not making the decision, but I wanted at least a discussion, and you're giving me the feedback, which is why it was a bad idea, but, you know... No, I understand the idea, but, yeah, I would just worry that, you know, the liability there and the job description is for them to get the kids across the street safely, and they're not doing that, you know, 100% of the time. They might have time to... do some parking enforcement. But, yeah, we certainly don't train them in that. And I don't believe they've ever really reported too much. Some of them do shake their fists at people speeding and different things, which we get complaints about that sometimes. So really want to just have them focus. But ultimately, I think, you know, if we can just get more information where we can have that focus on a certain time and location, we can do better. As a police department, either a community service worker or a police officer on duty can hit those spots, and usually once that happens, the word gets out, and hopefully it gets better. At least for a couple weeks, right? At least for a couple weeks. We can't be everywhere all the time, and I think people know that, so hopefully they don't take too much advantage of that. Always there when I was a kid. Good. The parking side of this discussion, but the pedestrian side of it? Yeah, and Amber is in charge of supervising the crossing guard, so she can definitely speak on that. All right. So are we placing it on file? I don't know we have to do anything other than... Okay, well, receiving place on file noted that we had a discussion. That's my motion. If it isn't the right motion, figure out what it should be and... And shill in the blanks. He seconded. Debates, all the debates. Okay, any further? We have a motion and a second. Any further discussion? If none, all in favor? Aye. All opposed? Okay. Looking for a motion to adjourn. So moved. Second. We are adjourned.